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re:my "outrageous posting"
Frank/Andy,
What I was saying was that at this stage of the Comp with 1 semi to be played, I feel Inst VS North Down would be a better game. To conclude that I only want the Top 4 Teams in the Cup is a ludicrous assumption!!
North Down have scored over 300 or above twice this season against better sides than Muckamore.
The debate may rage on but the reality is that the decision has been made.
Whoever wins the semi will face a massive task to beat North Down(favourites in my eyes) at the Green.
Hopefully Instonians can do their talking on the pitch to silence the mumblings off it.
Can someone please tell me what rule was broken here? The point is this subject is not mentioned in the rules, so each request is dealt with on its merits. The Union has always been sympathetic to clubs who have a Challenge Cup match scheduled when two or more players are away representing their country. There are a number of precedents for this in recent years, some of which are mentioned in an earlier post by Wylie. I don't remember us having this sort of controversy on those previous occasions. Let's now hope that the weather improves and that the semi final can be settled on the field next Sunday.
Roger
There is of course no rule in place (to postpone a game due to representative selection), the clubs voted it out at an NCU AGM around the turn of the Millennium.
And that is the crux of the matter - most club delegates I'm sure thought when they removed that rule democratically that they had removed the ability to postpone games due to representative selection, and would not expect to see the NCU introduce its own take on the subject in subsequent years.
IPS
Sub-Ed
I have read the debates re cup semi with interest. First and foremost the Senior Cup is special and will always be special. Some of my best memories of cricket are cup games over years. Some great moments of joy at Woodvale and North/quins/CSN and some moments of despair when losing. That is when you learn about yourself, your teammates and the opposition and is the joy of cricket. There is no better feeling than winning as an underdog and the cup should be played on the pitch, best fit xi vs best fit xi. Bowl outs are a cop out if you can play a game anywhere and that is a spirit of cricket comment.
All that said, rules are rules. look at the rules applied over the last 10 years or so.
North Down lost a league due to peter connellgate. CSN lost a league as they got a point deducted for being 1 minute over time. There were reasons for both but very quickly the rules were pointed at based on what was in the book and north down and csn suffered.
The rules are voted on by the clubs, upheld by the NCU and that should be done consistently and transparently. if the rules are not right, change them at next agm. this selective amendment is nonsense and i can see why it leads to so much frustration.
not sure where the "negativity from Moylena" comes from - along with John Stevenson, my postings were directed at the Emergency Committee not Instonians.
instead of bowl outs why cant we have a super over?
We're all assuming that both games in this debate will go ahead on that date....has any1 seen the weather that has prevented us from playing any normal cricket this past while. Probably best that no1 mentions the old "bowl-out" at this stage!
sorry just read Steven's posting - probably a fair shout on the arrogance!!!!
re Mr Brannigan
as I stated, which I will do again the rules are the rules and I feel we should be playing on Sunday - I don't believe criticism can be leveled at our club for asking the question to the NCU - the critism should be leveled at the NCU for saying yes to the postponement.
Having read these forums over recent years, when an incident like this occurs there is such venom directed at the club involved, which is completely irrational - Inst or any other individual club do not set or apply the rules.
My point in relation to international call ups was that if at the start of the season the NCU knows when Ireland/Ireland A fixtures are on their premier tournament should look to avoid clashes with these dates so as not to devalue the tournament. Similarly bowl outs should be avoided and the current rules where we only have two attempts does not seem fair considering most senior league teams are playing less cricket with the reduction in the size of the leagues - surely that has created more opportunity to play re-arrangements. Unavailability due to injuries/holidays is a completely separate matter and not somtheing that the NCU need consider.
As for the fixture itself - lets hope it gets played. The negativity coming from Moylena would suggest their chance has gone with this ruling - this is far from the case!
have just re Steve Crothers' outrageous posting. If we follow his logic then the Challenge Cup should be simply played between the top 4 sides in the Premier League and the rest can go and hang. Is he suggesting that entry to the cup be restricted to those sides that won't get hammered? But then I note that he gives his location as Shaw's Bridge so 'nuff said!
re Stephen Crothers, John Stevenson
Your response absolutely gob smacked me. Taken to its logical conclusion we should just have the Emergency Committee decide upon the two finalists (and do away with all those earlier rounds) because it would be "THE GAME". Typical Master Race, presumably from your location, arrogance.
Rules are rules Mr Stevenson and if Andy's research is correct then those in most cricketting circles would like to see them applied correctly. The game will be won or lost on the pitch and the fact that the Master Race side is weakened is just the luck of the draw. So if a Club had three members injured or three members on holiday should they not be afforded the same ruling? (Hopefully not because we'd never get the season finished but from a logical viewpoint, why not?) Quite a lot play rugby, hockey, football.... at the beginning and end of the season so why shouldn't we make an allowance?
Staggering arrogance from the Master Race. Do Ireland get to postpone their games because County's won't let more than three of their players go? If we need a "GOOD GAME" then let's forget about competition and play carefully matched exhibition teams.
As I pointed out in my initial posting there is no basis in any rule to support the arbitary decision taken bby the Emergency Committee but this has created a "precedent" that will no doubt be quoted in future "requests" and will therefore replicate the situation that the dropping of the original rule was meant to avoid. So the Emergency Committee has acted against the wishes of the clubs, as passed at AGMs, and I think that the time has come for the members of said Committee to resign.
Surely it is only fair that to have a proper debate on the semi final fixture that a fully fledged member of the afore mentioned master race has an input.
Unfortunately as I have now simply become one of those players who gets informed on a wed night who we are playing at the weekend and on which day and am not involved in all the politics that seem to engulf the game I cannot really comment in an informed manner on the matter.
I can see both sides. The rules are the rules and therefore why are we not playing? But at the same token, as I am sure waringstown will agree, the senior cup, where possible, should be won on the pitch with both teams able to field their strongest teams. In reality to avoid the issue we have encountered senior cup fixtures should be played on dates where international call ups will not impact, I am sure there are plenty of these.
I have heard a nasty rumour that my wife was on the emergency sub committee so I had no chance of missing my daughters 4th birthday!!
I have been out & about in cricket circles over the past couple of days and I am "amazed" by the reaction of many people who have told of their view that the the decision of the Emergency Committee is a nonsense - revisionism still alive & well in NCU circles. What really is the point of having an AGM?
IACUS have requested the details of scorers from all NCU clubs and as Secretary of NIACUS I am asking clubs to forward the following details to me.
Name of Scorer
Address
Telephone Numbers/email address
Level of qualification if any
Scorers or anyone wishing to score should note that NIACUS intends to organise a scoring seminar in early 2013 and that it would be beneficial for all scorers to attend. Further details will be made available by NIACUS.
There are previous precedence's for postponing the Muckamore v Instonians semi final to another date. I did a trawl back through my emails from the last number of years and found references to the following:
In 2004 the NCU received requests from clubs with players in the Ireland squad to postpone their Challenge Cup fixtures. Bearing in mind its desire to support the Ireland team and also not wishing to disadvantage clubs in our own leading cup competition the decision was taken then to allow clubs to postpone Challenge Cup fixtures if they wished. This dispensation was not granted for league fixtures.
In 2008 Waringstown were all allowed to postpone a Challenge Cup second round match because they had three players in the Ireland squad and Instonians were allowed to postpone their Challenge Cup second round match because Andrew White was with the Ireland squad.
Also in 2008 the continuation of a Challenge Cup quarter final involving North Down and Instonians, which was due to resume on a Monday night, was put back to the following Thursday as Ryan Haire had been called up to the Ireland squad to play New Zealand and Scotland.
Now I wasn’t involved in the current decision made by the NCU but surely ANY club who have three players missing on Ireland duty would ask for a Challenge Cup match to be postponed?
Take the best three players from your club’s First XI and tell me that you would be happy to play the match.
